The conversation: Is Everest overrun with tourists?

A photograph showing a row of climbers snaking up Everest has sparked controversy. Mountaineers Kenton Cool and Chris Bonington discuss whether the mountain has lost its magicA photograph taken by German mountaineer Ralf Dujmovits on 19 May showed a snake of tourists on their way to the summit of Everest; four people died on the mountain that weekend. Sir Chris Bonington, who climbed Everest in 1985 after a number of attempts, and Kenton Cool, who took the Olympic torch to the summit just over a week ago, discuss whether Everest has become too crowded. Emine Saner listens in.Chris Bonington: I'm glad I climbed Everest when I did. The Norwegian expedition I was a member of in 1985 was the last one where the Nepalese authorities allowed only one expedition on a route at a time. Today there are dozens of expeditions, but it was lovely having the mountain to ourselves.Kenton Cool: It is very different now. In the last week or so, with the publication of Ralf's picture, it would be easy to argue that Everest has become too crowded. But Everest is a big mountain and I don't think anybody can blame the Nepalese. I summited a week after the picture, 25 May, and it was busier than when you were there ? there were around 15 people ? but it wasn't overcrowded. But it does sadden me, because mountains are remarkable places to be. Standing on a summit is one of the many defining moments of an expedition. I don't know whether they were actually queuing at the top, but I think that experience would have dulled the sense of achievement.CB: Would it be a safer and better experience if there were fewer people going for the summit on any one day?KC: I'm not sure how you would limit the numbers. Would you do it on a first-come, first-served basis? Or by experience? Isn't that elitist? One of the beautiful things about our sport is if you want to go and climb Snowdon with no experience, that's entirely up to you. There is a permit to climb Everest, and it is expensive, which limits the number of people who can go, but there are very few regulations in our sport generally. Mountains are accessible.CB: I don't know what it's like now, but there have been a load of cowboys who have said they will guide people up. If you had one guide responsible for one client, that would be more expensive, but also much safer.KC: In the Himalayas you don't need a guiding qualification, but most of the reputable teams have one Sherpa leader to each client.Emine Saner: How do you feel about fixed lines on Everest?KC: You get the fixed ropes in place and people go up and down relying on them for safety ? but look at the 2008 disaster on K2 when the fixed line was swept away. By removing the fixed lines on Everest you could remove four-fifths of the crowding problem, if you think there is a problem, but commercialism means we try to fulfil people's aspirations, and one of the efficient ways is the use of fixed lines. I'm part of the commercial world ? I encourage people to come to Everest and look after them, but I also come from an alpine climbing background where you climb with just your rucksack, equipment and ropes between two or three very close friends. I would hate to limit people's ability to go into the mountains, but I'm not convinced that at some stage we won't have a disaster like in 1996 [when eight people died] due to mismanagement.CB: I think the fixed rope is inevitable and I have no problems with the concept of commercial climbing. It is here to stay. For every individual who gets to the top of Everest it is a life-changing experience, and I would hate to deny anyone that. When I summited Everest it was my last chance of getting up. It's an extraordinary experience and I think it is terrific for an ordinary person who has that dream to achieve it. When I did, it was an immensely emotional moment. From the top of Hillary Step to the summit, it is just one foot in front of the other, and the last few feet I was really struggling. I couldn't help thinking of friends who had lost their lives in the mountains, and I cried when I got to the top. The mix of joy and sorrow was an incredibly intense experience. We were lucky we got up on the perfect day. The view from the top of Everest is incredible, looking north across the Tibetan plateau, the snowcaps and the curvature of the Earth.KC: You've put that perfectly.CB: But it could be safer and better. There needs to be regulation. You have to have one guide to one person on the summit day, but the other factor is the guide's authority. If the guide says "we have to turn back", the client has to do it. There have been situations where a client has said, "I've paid $60,000 (�39,000), I'm going on." I believe there have been cases where the client has hit the Sherpa!KC: But how do you enforce that once you're up there? I think we've all experienced summit fever to a certain extent, and if you get, say a chief executive or whoever the client is, who has paid $60,000 or more, taken eight weeks off work and has a lot of pride riding on what he is trying to do, if a Sherpa says at the Hillary Step "you have to turn around", it's hard. You could fine them when they come down, but in the heat of the moment, summit fever can be all-encompassing. The whole thing needs to be managed better, maybe by the operators. But if next year on Everest, there's only one day when the weather is good and there are 500 people on the mountain and they realise it's the only day, how do you turn round to 450 of them and say they can't climb?ES: Has it just become something for inexperienced, rich tourists to tick off? Do people underestimate Everest?CB: It's not just for rich tourists. You get ordinary people who have saved and borrowed to realise this dream of standing on the highest point on Earth. Because there are fixed ropes and commercial expeditions, an ordinary person with comparatively little experience of mountaineering can attain that dream. I see nothing wrong with that.KC: You've got to go through ice, there is a risk of avalanche, rockfall, but more than anything, people forget sometimes that you're climbing in what's known as the "death zone". Human life cannot exist up there. As soon as you enter, the clock is ticking and you have a finite amount of time. You can't get a helicopter rescue there. The margins for error are tiny and you do get people who don't fully understand that. It can be the smallest things ? a dropped glove! ? that can turn into a life-threatening scenario. You're almost certainly going to lose fingers, if not your whole hand through a dropped glove. People pay their money and expect the summit to be achieved.ES: What about ethics? There has been criticism of some climbers who passed dying people on their way to the summit.CB: When you're an expedition of six or seven, you all know each other and you would never abandon somebody. One of the problems is that many of the people going up the fixed ropes are comparatively inexperienced, and where you have 20 different expeditions at the same time, the clients might think "he's not in our group, one of his Sherpas will look after him". Everyone should understand that in any multi-expedition climb if you see someone in trouble, you have to help that person and if that means sacrificing your summit, you sacrifice your summit. But for every instance where a person has been left, there are probably 100 where people have stopped to help.Mount EverestMountaineeringMountainsEmine Sanerguardian.co.uk © 2012 Guardian News and Media Limited or its affiliated companies. All rights reserved. | Use of this content is subject to our Terms & Conditions | More Feeds

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